Chabad And Observance

Hank Magitz writes on the Havdalah blog:

David and Hilda Landsman are looking for a place to live. After four
decades of residing in Rockaway, New Jersey, where they helped found
the first and only Orthodox minyan in the area, the retired couple
feels pushed out by Chabad of Northwest New Jersey.

“All they
wanted from us was our money,” says Mrs. Landsman whose husband is a
retired baker. “That’s the only time the Lubavitchers talked to us. But
I couldn’t keep giving them money. I have my own bills to pay. And when
I stopped giving them money, suddenly no one was buying our challohs.”

Landsmans were one of several families who poured heart and soul into
building an active, dedicated Orthodox group in White Meadow Lake, a
suburb in Rockaway Township. Then Asher Herson of Chabad came to town
promising to help build the community and offered to take over the
minyan. “They wanted us to pay his mortgage,” recalls Mrs. Landsman.
“But I could barely afford my own.” The Hersons did manage to get
financial support from wealthy backers outside the community, then they
took over the small group. But today, most shomer-Shabbos members have
been driven away from the community by the lack of observance they’ve
seen; today, any number of cars pull up to the “shul” on Shabbos, then
drive off after services. The Chabad Center, whose leadership includes
mixed marriages, encourages membership from wealthy patrons as far as
20 miles away.…

Asher Herson’s father is one of the most senior (and wealthiest) shluchim worldwide, controlling a territory rich with mega-donors. Among other enterprises, Herson runs Morristown, the Chabad mega-yeshiva. There, for many years, students got lunches that consisted of one sardine, a small baked potato, a small scoop of potato salad, and a small scoop of fried potatos. And those were the lucky ones. Most did not get the sardine. Meanwhile herson raised millions of dollars for buidings and other projets and was millions of dollars in the black. He would refuse to take baalei teshuva unless they first agreed to take out a government student loan and hand it over to him – this from an institution that had raised millions of dollars on baalei teshuva. Is herson a pariah in Chabad? No. He sits  on a Chabad vaad and is as senior as a shaliach can get without being Rabbis Krinsky or Shemtov. What Chabad is doing in Rockaway is exactly what Marvin Schick is concerned about. And it is exactly what others somehow ignore.



Filed under Chabad Theology

42 responses to “Chabad And Observance

  1. aaronaaron

    first, i think like in anyother case before you judge you should hear the other side!!!(remember– there are always 2 sides to every story!!) just like when the lefty newspaper says something against israel you say oh that cant be i better hear the other side so too does lubavitch(jews also-believe it or not)secondly, i was in morristown and thank g-d the food was great and very tasty and there was always plenty of it. thirdly, where do u think the extra money goes??? the shluchim dont drive mercedes and dont live in huge homes it obviously goes to fund more projects

  2. Dovid Lerner

    You know, I learnt in Morristown for 3 years, the food was excellent, AND, there was always enough for everybody… Maybe it used to be different.

  3. Dovid Lerner

    Plus, I know for a fact that there are several students each year (some in the Ba’al Teshuvah, some in Tomchei T’mimim) who are paying nothing for tuition. I saw the paperwork these students have, I don’t have it on hearsay.

    While I don’t agree with many of Herson’s policies, (hell, the few times a year he’d farbreng I wouldn’t attend ’cause he always repeated the same stories), he still has an amazing Yeshivah.

    I know that it used to be at a much greater level as far as Torah-study, but times change (yeridas hadoros maybe?) I keep in touch with some of the people there, it currently (Tomchei Temimim) has the highest amount of students it has ever had, it got to the point they hired new Ram”im.

    (Believe me, as someone who was on student aid I know what sort of people the administration are, (tell your parents that if we don’t get the paperwork…), however, I owe most of my knowledge in Torah to Morristown.

  4. horodoker

    Shmarya, I am new to the site, so please pardon my ignorance, but do you HATE lubavitch(er’s)?

  5. Mr Cohen

    I don’t how this is revelant but Scott Rosenberg is extremly overweight.
    Maybe the Rebbe ZaTZal should have taken time off from his rigorous daily schedule to help solve obesity in america.

  6. Eddie

    I was in the school the food was the best i ever had in yeshivah believe me i would eat there anyday of the week i couldint stop laughing at the whole sardine statement gosh where did you come up with that one? you and jay leno LOL anyway teaches us young ones a lesson never NEVER believe what someone writes

  7. The Morristown I describe is EXACTLY what Morristown was like in the mid-1980’s. There were at least two food strikes and other student disturbaces as well.

    As for the ‘quality’ of the learning, the average class downstairs in the BT yeshiva had 18 students and one teacher. In Aish HaTorah, it was 6 students to one teacher, and then there were tutors and experts in the Beit Midrash to help as well. Aish had a couple thousand books in its library. Morristown (downstairs) had maybe 150.

    Herson got in trouble with other shluchim over his financial aid rip-off and related scams. When HaDar HaTorah closed for a year or so, Herson was forced to change some of that. When hadar hatorah was open, it took in anybody who wanted to try to learn, whether or not they could pay (and whether or not they could qualify for a student loan). The physical condition of the place was not great, but the library had many more books than Morristown and the food in those days was consistantly better and more plentyful. And none of these deals with Lipsker’s abuses, which took place openly right under Herson’s nose. He did not notices these problems until Lipsker’s public messianism endangered his fundraising.

  8. “Shmarya, I am new to the site, so please pardon my ignorance, but do you HATE lubavitch(er’s)?”

    Just Vitebskers.

  9. be smart!


    you shoot yourself in the foot when you say that Morristown Y gives sardines. You are obviously filled with such hate of R. Herson that you can say that night is day. He gives an abundance of food to the boys that even a boy who is not so content about the yeshiva (in other aspects) is extremely happy with the abundance of of food and good food (and a great cook).

    Likewise with tuition: R Herson (while demanding money from whoever can pay) will go a few extra miles to allow the boy who is unable to pay, to the extent not taking from him *anytihng*.

  10. Aviel

    I learned a couple of years ago in Morristown and the Chabad shluchim of my hometown arranged the tuition so I didn’t have to pay anything and they served lots of food, chicken etc. There was absolutely no complaint about the food, rather many said that they never had better food in any yeshiva and that the great food at Morristown was part of the reason they wanted to learn there. Now I’m no fan of Chabad, but I think it’s important to point out that if there were food problems they were solved years ago. One complaint though is that the food was really fattening with all the frying in oil…

  11. “Be Smart” and Aviel –

    Is it really that hard for you to follow the comments? Morristown was EXACTLY as I portrayed it until Hadar Hatorah closed and the shluchim FORCED Herson to change (somewhat). Having competition from Sea Gate has also forced change.

    As for the oil, there was a fire (I think in 1985) during Hanukka. Some bochrim from Tomchei put wicks in a plate of spaghetti and sauce and lit them. There was so much oil in the sauce that the spaghetti burned. The bochrim left after a while and the spaghetti eventually burned through the plastic plate and the plastic chair it was sitting on.

    Oil is cheap and filling. herson uses copious amounts of it. It was the major complaint of bochrim 20 years ago.

  12. I must’ve missed the sardines. I was at the RCA in ’84 and the food was good news and bad news: The bad news was the only thing for lunch was horseshit; the good news is there was plenty of it…
    Herson shouldn’t be criticized for serving sardines & three types of potatoes. He should be brought to task for being a meglomaniac that did everything he could to make legit rabbis like the Bogomilskis, Levi Bloch, Boruch Cohen, etc. seem like radicals. Herson is about power & control. He could honestly care less about the Rebbe’s mission.

  13. be smart!

    since you admit that he changed from his practices about the food, and for the past decade it is plentiful and good, why mention it TODAY when he learnt the lesson (and he should be commended for this)?

    btw: since Herson is from the only who fought false messianism (regardless of the reason) he should be commended for that. And yet you use his enemies who one of the greatest reasons for their enmity to him is that he cut the false messianism.

    You want to have both ways: critizie chaad at all costs. when it suits youyou condemn the messianists, when it suits you, you use their flase defamation against people like r herson. for shame…

  14. Naftali Lowenstein

    “be smart” isn’t so smart. Herson never fought false messianism — he did what was expediant for HIS organization. His top contributors and board members, like Robert Felzenberg (who was later convicted on federal charges of grand larceny) did not believe that the “Messiah play” was good for business, so Herson used that as his excuse to rid the RCA of his enemies, like Lipskier. But he also cleared the decks of solid rabbis who were not Messichistim by any stretch of the imagination. Moshe Herson is a phoney.

  15. And, besides that, I was a critic of Herson long before any of that was an issue. So “be smart,” take your own advice and go learn.

  16. Anonymous

    This link discusses Moshe Herson’s friend and supporter Robert Felzenberg and the crimes he was convicted of:

    A google search of “Robert Felzenberg” provides more information. In the 1980s, Felzenberg was vice-chaireman of Herson’s Rabbinical College of America.

  17. be smart!

    HOw do *prove* that he did it for bussiness play? maybe he was concerned for the honour of the Rebbe? Just because your ex friends lipsker and co. and his brainwashed souls shared their feelings with you doees not make true or right,

  18. “be smart” is obviously a product of Chabad yeshivas because his grammar is fourth grade at best. But no matter.

    Avroham Lipkier never shared his feelings about anything with me, and I was his student. He and took the high ground and refused to talk about what Herson did to him. I don’t buy his meshichist nonsense–but when it comes to integrity, Lipkier has Herson beat hands down.

    Here’s a little song my kids sing:

    “Meshichistin, Meshichistin!
    A bissil Jewish–a bissil christian.
    Oh they act like a crazy person,
    but they’re more sincere than the Hersons.”

  19. be smart!

    exactly what i thought. you were affected by lipsker and his “integrity”. The fact that lots of students of lipsker were affected by him to the extent: that either they are hard core meshichisten or they were charmed by him to feel pity on him on what herson did to him. and yet shmarya the hypocrite wants people to fight meshichisten but will use any such fight against meshichisten to indicate lubavitch “power” and he will rail at them for looking for power etc..

    and mr hank i doubt your integrity. I don’t buy your word against herson’s words or against all lubavitch who are head shluchim to ipso facto holy. The fact that you were affected by a meshchiti who acts vbissil christian has tainted “a bissil” your judgment to think crooked like the meshchiten.

  20. You’re confused, “be smart” — I said I liked Lipsker (Lipskier?) personally; he was warm and charming, unlike Herson who struck me as the kind of guy who’d ask a woman for a handjob on the first date. But from a religious vantage point, I don’t agree with Lipsker about very much. If it was only about a theological point of view, I’d keep my small voice out of it, but Herson’s motives are suspect when we see him pull these same “purges” on non-Meshichistim (like the Bogomilsky family of rabbis who predated Herson’s presence in NJ). Moshe Herson has been eliminating his enemies for years. He has all the scruples of a snake oil salesman, but none of the charm. At least Lipsker (snake oil or not) had charm.

  21. And another thing, “be smart,” in the interests of educating you:

    You write, “I don’t buy your word against herson’s words or against all lubavitch who are head shluchim to ipso facto holy.” Allowing for your piss-poor lack of syntacs, I assume you are saying that Herson and other heads of state are pure as the driven snow. I wouldn’t know. I can only tell you that in *my* experiences (and, despite your implications, I have no personal bias) Herson and his sons are business men, not theologians. That is to say that their stated mission is NOT their true agenda. Unlike real shluchim, who put their comfort and personal well-being on the line for “the mission,” the Herson gang is about power and money.

    I’ve had no first-hand experiences with Berel Shemtov or Baruch Shlomo Cunin, but I *have* interviewed a number of shluchim who work or worked for them. Hard as I find it to believe, they are even bigger bastards than the Hersons. I can give you examples, but you’re not really interested, are you?

    Have you read “Cunin’s Big Breakfast” yet? You can bet your ass Cunin did.

  22. aaron

    to hank magitz and to all else, i just dont get it!! what are you trying to bring out with these stupid stories?? if they are true(which i highly doubt because ive had first hand encounters and disagree with you) then are trying to discredit the whole chabad and the 44 years of the rebbes tireless efforts(and i dont mean that the rebbe dosent work for klal yisrael anymore, he still continues to perform miracles daily and help thousands of people) because of one foolish or a few foolish shluchim? the BOTTOM LINE IS THAT THE OFFICIAL DERECH FOR CHABAD IS THAT OF THE REBBE and not a few shluchim who may or may not be following these ways. so dont try to discredit the amazing works of lubavitch worldwide for well over 50 years because of “these incidents” that may of never happened. oh and by the way if you wanted i can tell you many mirtacles that still happen daily.

  23. aaron

    to shmarya its interesting that a man named david berger (who probably thinks along the same crooked lines as you do and has much sinas chinum) thought he was very intelligent for writing a book bashing lubavitch and allegedly discrediting it. however there was some lubavitch rabbi that came along i think his name was rabbi imanuel shochet and some others who tottaly took his book apart point by point and “schluged him up”!! i was just wondering why you dont also put a link next to the book of our side of it(halacha). im just amazed by the iggnorence of all of you guys and baseless hatred. and ill repeat it once again there is no man in this generation who even comes to the heals of the lubavitcher rebbe in any aspect(whether torah seforim that he made or knew or all the miracles or all the mekuravim that he made- my family included or all of the torah instituions and yeshivas)and ill say it clearly like always which none of you seem to comply dont argue concepts or ideas without proof, i want clear proof!!! have fun go ahead and get back to me when you find it!!!

  24. aaron

    oh and by the way shmarya i dont think you answered the question earlier– do you hate lubavitchers?? its a nice way to avoid the question and if i recall its a yes or no question

  25. Dovid Lerner

    Okay, why do my fellow Lubavitchers make such assholes out themselves when posting? People! You do Chabad no favors by writing like idiots!!

    Re: Herson
    In My time in Morristown, I quickly saw how he runs the entire concept of Shlichus like a buisness. Every single Chabad-house in NJ is a branch of the “Rabbinical College of America”. It would seem that anyone who was there before the RCA opened (in the 60’s, originaly in Newark, in 1972 it moved to Morristown), has either “enrolled” or been delegitimatized.

    I don’t think Herson is much of an hardcore anti-mishechist, for example, he has no problem if Yechi is said in Tomchei, but G-d help you if you say it in Tiferes (where, -thank G-d- they tell them that the Rebbe isn’t Moshiach), kind of a double standard, no?

    Many people think that the fight between him and Rabbi Carlebach is the mishechist issue (Rabbi Carlebach is a mishechist), I personaly think it’s over money and power.

    To describe Rabbi Herson in one word: shrewd. He has over the years improved the gashmiyus of the yeshivah to the extent that it’s the best in Lubavitch Yeshivah’s. Over my years there extensive renovations were done on the dorms and the bathrooms, the kitchen got new equipment this year and so on. The Bochurim are treated extremly well in Morristown now, it may have different 20 years ago, but times change.

  26. be smart!

    Mr Hank: btw “syntacs” is written “syntax”. (which btw have nothing to do with the merits of the points).

    1) “charm” is deceiving. and does not prove *integrity*.

    2) You judge R. Herson by your “impressions” of…(you gruber yung that you are).

    3) Brainwashing people is not a sign of a role model and not even a mentch. (Lipsker).

    4) Many of his students are filled with hate towards those who do not agree with their “theology”.

    5) Your examples of non-meshichisten: Rabbi Bogomilsky: Rabbi Shmuel Pessach Bogomilsky is one of the fellows who support meshichisten strongly speaks against anti meshichisten etc. (I’m not talknig about his son).

    While you may have some valid points and some people could change and fix their problems; your background though is connected with being affected by “snale oil” and fake charm, whose poisonous teachings brought hate and discord towards: non meshichisten within lubavitch and towards other “non beleiver jews” in particular.


  27. be smart!


    What makes you think that you are *proving* that he is not an anti meshichist by allowing a few (minority) individuals say yechi on their own (when they have been educated with this nonsense before and thinking that it’s worthless to wage a war on these few inidivduals’ while making a policy of not educating a fresh Baal Teshuva this nonsense (especially when he had a very poor experience in the past when BT were educated with this nonsense)?

    And while I may agree with some of the critics that he should lay off hands a little bit (and there may be some money issues revolving the setuo), why don’t you see the possibility that R. Herson has a responsibility to present the official Lubavitch position that everyone under it’s body reject basic tenets of the Meshichist positions, forces him to unite all organziations under RCA?

    After all: does R. Herson micromanage and mix in any other issues of all the chabad houses under RCA?

  28. Manny Schochet lied and misquoted Berger. You may want to actually read Berger’s book and then read Schochet afterward. You’ll learn something.

    You may disagree with Berger, but he is not a liar and he did not misquote the Rebbe (or Manny Schochet) to make his points.

  29. aaron

    shmarya, david berger was actually proven wrong– 100 percent. also you still didnr answer the question do you hate lubavitch and actually it is a yes or no question

  30. aaron

    and i see again more lies– where exactly did r. shochet lie and misquote david berger??

  31. 1. In the Jewish Press.

    2. Nobody is lying here.

    3. The Rebbe said that the Rambam’s pesak dinim on moshiach were the halakha because no one argues on him. I the uncensored edition of the Rambam’s Yad, in hilchot melachim, the Rambam lists everything moshiach must do to be the moshiach. Then, he writes: If he (the “candidate”) does not succeed up to this point (in doing all these things) or he is killed, HE IS SURELY *NOT* THE MOSHIACH PROMISED BY THE TORAH – He should be considered a just and righteous king of the Davidic Dynasty WHO DIED.

    As for the Abarbanel, he brings the opinion you mention AND REFUTES IT. He does not endorse it, he rejects it out of hand.

  32. Replying to Aaron who writes, “what are you trying to bring out with these stupid stories? if they are true… then are [you] trying to discredit the whole chabad and the 44 years of the rebbes tireless efforts… because of one foolish or a few foolish shluchim?”
    Well, I think you just hit the nail on the head. Taking Herson/Cunin/etc. to task for megalomaniacal behavior, for being concerned with little more than their own power trips, is an effort to UNDO the discredit THEY BRING to the Rebbe’s tireless efforts; it’s an attempt to separate between the sacred and the real estate developers. And I say this as an observant Jew who is specifically NOT a meshichist, but one who respected the Rebbe’s efforts and feels betrayed by the little men who use his name for their own selfish ends.
    Clearly, I am not theologically aligned with owner of this site, who has his own views and agenda, but I stand emphatically by beliefs that have been informed by the spiritual atrocities I’ve seen committed by the little men who assumed power in the Rebbe’s absence. Indeed, I defy you to find educated, observant Jews in New Jersey (and I dare say the Left Coast) who see the Herson-Cunin cartel as anything other than corrupt and self-serving. That is, unless they are on the payroll (i.e., employees of Chabad of NJ, of Calif., etc.) or recent, starry-eyed BTs who just don’t know any better. Yet.

  33. Hank Magitz

    In answer to “be smart”: Thank you for admitting that I’ve made “some valid points” and “some people [i.e., Herson/Cunin] could change and fix their problems.” But you know they won’t. There’s no profit in it.

    Your assertion that my background “is connected with being affected by snake oil and fake charm” [i.e., Avroham Lipsker] is misinformed. I haven’t seen him in more than a decade. I carefully avoid rabid meshichisten. My “background” and foreground contain a wide variety of frum Yiddin from all walks of Yiddishe life. And all of them, to the man, are, at best, embarrassed by Chabad. Most are disgusted by it.

    As for Dovid’s point that Morristown has both yechi-niks and non-yechi-niks, go and see for yourself: Tomchei is one thing and Tiferes is another. But the baal habatim’s shul “Levi Yitzchok” (which is on campus) is STRICTLY a nest of Yechi-niks. And Herson’s only objection to them is when the shul president – the affable, beloved Moshe M. – doesn’t grease Herson’s palm.

  34. Aviel

    As far as I know there were plenty of bochrim in Tiferes that had stickers and posters proclaimin the L-rebbe to be Mashiach. They would also argue for it, so even the “anti” are not really anti the idea of him being Mashiach – only anti proclaiming him to be that all over the world. That goes for the shluchim where I live too.

  35. be smart!

    ” But the baal habatim’s shul “Levi Yitzchok” (which is on campus) is STRICTLY a nest of Yechi-niks. And Herson’s only objection to them is when the shul president – the affable, beloved Moshe M. – doesn’t grease Herson’s palm”.

    The reason for it being a nest is the result that the Baalley Teshuva who live there are for the most part pupils of Lipsker. Herson cannot simply close down the congregation on those grounds, so he uses his leverage within his means.

    In short: 1) You must acknowledge that meshichism is a problem (“abissil christian”). 2) Therefore it makes sense that a responsible shliach remove vestiges of this malady. 3) Herson has a responsibility and *obligation* to thwwart it 4) It is also logical that he does where he is likely to succeed more in his efforts and where it is more important. 5) therefore: the yeshivos are not a nest for this malady. Tiferes is compltely out of it. Tomchey: who have boys who were already educated with this malady from before, does not allow proselyizing but they are not thrown out for their own personal beleifs. And the Shul who have married people with their mind made up already cannot be fought the same way as the others. 6) For someone (shmarya or even Hank) who understands the dangers of this cult and yet attacks the person who attacks the cult is hypochrisy and lack of honesty at best and it may perhaps involve being affected by the fake “charm” of people around the cult itself (who at least managed to poison the minds of their followers to amplify the problem of “magalomania” to the highest degree so that these fake charmers gain more followers in thier counter attack at herson etc.

  36. YBM

    Chabad’s attitude to observance is complex.
    Their own personal observance of “visible” rituals (distinctly from derekh eretz, adam lachaveiro) is impeccable.
    As to the observance of non-anash would be converts to their “cult”, they will bend over backwards to compete with “anybody” over allowable degree of tolerance.
    Reform, reconstructionists,anybody, they are proud of it.
    Oh! they are not judgemental they will tell you. Whichever way you want! Just come! Just be on the mailing list! Then, like trading baseball cards, they approach a throne of glory, one presided by G… himself or the other by their Rebbe and they will say, here we brought for you the soul of a,b,c or d. (oops, he commuted, he drove and what not).
    They will tell you that they are G-d’s salesmen, not his policemen !
    At the same time, they don’t tell you that, they are G-d’s bouncers at the nightclub’s doors, complete with booze and all.
    Like Saint Peter (lehovdil) they will decide who is jewish, who is orthodox (don’t kid yourself, sane orthodox are their biggest ennemies).
    And this in chabadese is called frumkeit, keiruv. 🙂

  37. Anonymous

    aaron rabbi berger put out a book that should have bin put out ten years ago

  38. Anonymous

    Orthodox Victims of Moshe Herson’s (and Asher Herson’s) “ahavas Yisroel” include:

    * Boruch Blank (non-meshichist, formerly of Morristown)
    * Norman and Baili Mandel (non-Chabad, Morristown)
    * Aaron Dukes (meshichist, formerly of Morristown)
    * Rabbi Eli Rothman (Chabad of Pittsburg, formerly of Morristown)
    * Rabbi Mordechi Weiss (non-meshichist, Israel Chabad, formerly of Teaneck, NJ)
    * Rabbi Michel Gurkov (current Herson employee in Wayne, NJ; spoke to reporter regarding his boss, then begged to return after establishing successful Chabad franchise)
    * Rabbi Y. Lebovic (meshichist? It’s hard to say. Took over Rabbi Sholom. B. Gordon’s shul in Maplewood, NJ; formerly of Morristown)
    * Rabbi Avraham Lipsker (meshichist)
    * Rabbi Yosef Yitzchok Lipsker (meshichist)
    * Rabbi Greenberg (meshichist)
    Joan Baron (non-Meshichist, formerly of Morristown)
    * Levi Baron (non-Meshichist, formerly of Morristown)
    * Benny Baron (non-Meshichist, formerly of Morristown)
    * Rabbi Yisroel Teitelbaum (not a meshichist; current Herson employee in Morristown so he’s shackled, but his adult children will tell you the truth)
    * Sheila Levin (not a meshichist, Rockaway, NJ)
    * Larry Teitel (not a meshichist, formerly of Rockaway, NJ; currently in Highland Park)
    Rabbi Mendel Bogomilsky (currently in Millburn, NJ; not a meshichist)
    * Rabbi Bogomilsky Sr. (meshichist? Not certain. Maplewood, NJ)
    * Rabbi Levi Bloch (Chabad Torah Center, Newark, NJ – not a meshichist)
    * Rabbi Yosef Zvi Carlebach (meshichist, New Brunswick, NJ)
    * Rabbi Baruch Goodman (meshichist, New Brunswick, NJ)
    * Rabbi Yehuda Spritzer (meshichist, Monroe Twp.)
    * Simcha Krause (not a meshichist, Passaic, NJ; formerly of Morristown)
    * Rabbi Dovid Morris (meshichist, formerly of Morristown)
    * Jeff Janock (not a meshichist, formerly of Rockaway, NJ)

    Note that only 40% of the above are meshichistin.

  39. Anonymous

    A few more…

    * Rabbi Boruch Cohen (not a meshichist; Chai Center, Michigan; formerly of Rockaway and Morristown)
    * David & Hilda Landsman (see article that began this thread; not meshichistin)

  40. Frank Zappa

    We’re only in it for the money.

  41. be smart!

    RAbbi Bogomilsky senior: big meshichist and aligns himself with the meshichitin to fight non meshichist rabbonim.

  42. Anonymous

    isnt it funney that chabad seem to not mix well with anybody that has more then a first grade jewish education

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